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    A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

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    sKiZo

    Posts : 1285
    Join date : 2013-04-01
    Location : Michigan USA

    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by sKiZo on Tue Mar 31, 2015 2:13 pm

    To the best of my knowledge and upon relatively close inspection, I'm of the opinion that the box set I received from Archiv is apparently an original Sony 2012 release. Sony CD media, identified as such in the engraved center ring, with silver backs as you'd expect to find on an OEM factory release, would tend to support that statement.

    Either that or it's a VERY GOOD counterfeit ... That said, no promise as to what you'd personally receive if you were to purchase.

    (There ... I believe that's enough in the way of qualifiers ... now yer on yer own)

    Long as we're on the subject ... the NBC Symphony has an interesting history. Put together exclusively for the Maestro Hisself, it consisted primarily of expatriates from WWII and post war Europe. Helps that they paid the highest salaries of the day and had some real rabid head hunters scouring the continents for playas. Didn't hurt that they got to perform in a state of the art studio (8H) designed and built exclusively for them. Sort of the music world's version of the space program, it gathered together the best of the best under one roof. Not often that the planets align to that degree ...

    Correction on the Toscanini collection ... it's the RCA years, not the NBC years.

    Last ten disks of the set cover some tidbits from the NY Philharmonic, BBC, Philadelphia, and Scalla years ...


    Last edited by sKiZo on Tue Mar 31, 2015 3:52 pm; edited 1 time in total

    Kentley

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    Location : Worcester, MA

    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by Kentley on Tue Mar 31, 2015 2:22 pm

    All fascinating history - and sadly this sort of progressive activity could never take place in our nutty world today.
    Funny story re:Studio 8H - in my rock days, my band made a demo for RCA in - yup - 8H. This was the morning after jamming with Frank Zappa hisself, Jimmy Carl Black, Odetta, Bobby Columby {a-hole!}, all until 4 A.M. at the infamous Cafe Au Go-Go in early 1969. Zappa was a gracious gentleman, BTW and had I been older than my 17 long years, I would have ended up A Mother.
    Now I'm just a Mofo.

    corndog71

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    Location : It can get windy here

    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by corndog71 on Tue Mar 31, 2015 3:09 pm

    Kentley wrote:
    That thar's a beaut. How heavy does the extra steel make the amp?
    Thanks for the sympathy. The snootyness bothered me for all of two minuets {sic}.

    It's actually an aluminum box by Hammond. If I remember correctly it weighed in around 36 pounds. 17x17x4. Not as compact as the original Dynaco but I haven't needed to move it much and aside from the PT and the tubes it stays nice and cool.

    Tube Nube

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    Age : 53
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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by Tube Nube on Tue Mar 31, 2015 5:29 pm

    I read that thread, and tried to hear his tone as perhaps a form of humour, as I commented under my other user name there. But it's quite the contortionist move trying to find a shadow for doubt -- It was a rude remark that takes advantage of a new comer's enthusiasm to "put him in his place." And what place is that?

    To an extent, I agree with Bob, there are some hard core guys there who build their own designs or re-work those of others. But that forum, it seems to me, has always catered to new comers, to those who come to learn, and has certainly accepted those building from plans and kits as welcome under the rubric of "D I Y." I got a lot of helpful and always friendly assistance through building 2 sets of speakers from Planet 10 plans.

    That poster on DIY was just rude and it was uncalled for.

    For what it's worth, I've never seen that kind of rudeness over hear, though you certainly do see all the technical advice you would want, generously provided by folks with all kinds of expertise, and it never comes with even a hint of condescension. At least so far as I've seen it.

    Welcome the this forum, Kentley. From the humour conveyed in your review, and subsequent posts on this thread, it's clear you'll fit right in nicely here. Glad to make your acquaintance.

    Brenton

    Kentley

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by Kentley on Tue Mar 31, 2015 5:38 pm

    [quote="Tube Nube"]I read that thread, and tried to hear his tone as perhaps a form of humour, as I commented under my other user name there. But it's quite the contortionist move trying to find a shadow for doubt -- It was  a rude remark that takes advantage of a new comer's enthusiasm to "put him in his place." And what place is that?

    To an extent, I agree with Bob, there are some hard core guys there who build their own designs or re-work those of others. But that forum, it seems to me, has always catered to new comers, to those who come to learn, and has certainly accepted those building from plans and kits as welcome under the rubric of "D I Y."  I got a lot of helpful and always friendly assistance through building 2 sets of speakers from Planet 10 plans.

    That poster on DIY was just rude and it was uncalled for.

    For what it's worth, I've never seen that kind of rudeness over hear, though you certainly do see all the technical advice you would want, generously provided by folks with all kinds of expertise, and it never comes with even a hint of condescension. At least so far as I've seen it.

    Welcome the this forum, Kentley. From the humour conveyed in your review, and subsequent posts on this thread, it's clear you'll fit right in nicely here. Glad to make your acquaintance.


    Brenton

    Thank you, Brenton. I continue to be genuinely pleased by the information, good cheer, and acceptance level here. It seems unfortunate that much online discussion has devolved into pettiness and idle name-calling. But not on the Dynaco Tube forum. It's a great club.

    MontanaWay

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by MontanaWay on Tue Mar 31, 2015 5:44 pm

    Kentley wrote:
    Tube Nube wrote:I read that thread, and tried to hear his tone as perhaps a form of humour, as I commented under my other user name there. But it's quite the contortionist move trying to find a shadow for doubt -- It was  a rude remark that takes advantage of a new comer's enthusiasm to "put him in his place." And what place is that?

    To an extent, I agree with Bob, there are some hard core guys there who build their own designs or re-work those of others. But that forum, it seems to me, has always catered to new comers, to those who come to learn, and has certainly accepted those building from plans and kits as welcome under the rubric of "D I Y."  I got a lot of helpful and always friendly assistance through building 2 sets of speakers from Planet 10 plans.

    That poster on DIY was just rude and it was uncalled for.

    For what it's worth, I've never seen that kind of rudeness over hear, though you certainly do see all the technical advice you would want, generously provided by folks with all kinds of expertise, and it never comes with even a hint of condescension. At least so far as I've seen it.

    Welcome the this forum, Kentley. From the humour conveyed in your review, and subsequent posts on this thread, it's clear you'll fit right in nicely here. Glad to make your acquaintance.


    Brenton

    Thank you, Brenton. I continue to be genuinely pleased by the information, good cheer, and acceptance level here. It seems unfortunate that much online discussion has devolved into pettiness and idle name-calling. But not on the Dynaco Tube forum. It's a great club.

    well I gave him my 'friendly' thoughts on that forum's thread..... Evil or Very Mad

    sKiZo

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by sKiZo on Tue Mar 31, 2015 5:54 pm

    Newbies ... can't even quote a post properly ... (grumble grouse)

    Just ripped La Mer and Iberia from the Toscanini set ... now I can't get that stoopid song out of my head ...

    .

    .

    .

    Da wheels on De bussy go round and round
    Round and round
    Round and round ...


    Kentley

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by Kentley on Tue Mar 31, 2015 5:59 pm

    sKiZo wrote:Newbies ... can't even quote a post properly ... (grumble grouse)

    Just ripped La Mer and Iberia from the Toscanini set ... now I can't get that stoopid song out of my head ...

    .

    .

    .

    Da wheels on De bussy go round and round
    Round and round
    Round and round ...



    Toscanini's La Mer is fantastic - energetic and concise. Used to own on LP and it really works.

    Tube Nube

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by Tube Nube on Tue Mar 31, 2015 6:13 pm

    Oi! This is what happens when 3 forum nuts come out to play,
    On the dynaco forum one day.

    deepee99

    Posts : 1260
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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by deepee99 on Tue Mar 31, 2015 7:23 pm

    Kentley wrote:
    sKiZo wrote:Newbies ... can't even quote a post properly ... (grumble grouse)

    Just ripped La Mer and Iberia from the Toscanini set ... now I can't get that stoopid song out of my head ...


    Da wheels on De bussy go round and round
    Round and round
    Round and round ...



    Toscanini's La Mer is fantastic - energetic and concise. Used to own on LP and it really works.

    La Merdre is even better, but hard to find a clean copy.

    Kentley

    Posts : 295
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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by Kentley on Tue Mar 31, 2015 7:27 pm

    deepee99 wrote:
    Kentley wrote:
    sKiZo wrote:Newbies ... can't even quote a post properly ... (grumble grouse)

    Just ripped La Mer and Iberia from the Toscanini set ... now I can't get that stoopid song out of my head ...


    Da wheels on De bussy go round and round
    Round and round
    Round and round ...



    Toscanini's La Mer is fantastic - energetic and concise. Used to own on LP and it really works.

    La Merdre is even better, but hard to find a clean copy.

    So when's the book coming out, Dr. D.P.? Razz

    skriefal

    Posts : 116
    Join date : 2011-09-20
    Location : Utah, USA

    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by skriefal on Tue Mar 31, 2015 8:30 pm

    corndog71 wrote:Some kids these days I think are turned off by superfluous marketing.

    Hey... I'm no kid!  Just a software engineer who looks down on marketing departments (aka 'deceivers'). Smile

    Kentley

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by Kentley on Tue Mar 31, 2015 9:07 pm

    skriefal wrote:
    corndog71 wrote:Some kids these days I think are turned off by superfluous marketing.

    Hey... I'm no kid!  Just a software engineer who looks down on marketing departments (aka 'deceivers'). Smile

    A few comments about marketing, if I may.
    The vast majority of "marketing" has devolved into "let's make consumers feel they NEED our product, which btw we know is cheap crap they don't even want."
    No wonder most thinking people are averse to anything which reeks of salesmanship.
    VTA relies on word-of-mouth to promote its products. It's what marketing should be. VTA consists of two passionately commited DIYers who happen to have conceived of products which are great and affordable. There is no Marketing Department. Bob and Roy also contract a few others to do builds on a piece-by-piece basis at lower-than-competitive rates.
    When I first spoke to Bob - on the TELEPHONE, mind you - to discuss options for my ST-120 he actually tried to talk me out of options which he considered superfluous, such as the time-delay relay board in a circuit which is tube-rectified. This does not conform to our jaded conception of a marketeer. Contrast this with the rep of a certain major tube equipment manufacturer who, when consulted re: tube subs for a preamp I own, told me point-blank that I was taking a terrible risk by not purchasing their "special" tube sets, which btw consist of the cheapest trash on the market marked up 400%.
    I think I've made my point. I shut up now.. sunny

    MarcVBelgium

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by MarcVBelgium on Wed Apr 01, 2015 5:52 am

    Kentley wrote:
    Dale Stevens wrote:Kently, excellent! Wish you would post this on  www.diyaudio.com/forums  !!
     

    I got this rather off-putting response on diyaudio to my repost of this innocent little piece this A.M.:

    http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/272245-tube-newbies-review-vta-st-120-a-new-post.html

    It does not fill me with enthusiasm nor eagerness to enjoin that veddy British community. I sense a whiff of ozone tinged with sulphur, and I much prefer the clean fresh air wafting thru this much-more-open space. I'm too old to enjoy being hazed.


    Kentley,

    I've been reading this tread on diyaudio.com...... their title says it all : "Projects by fanatics, for fanatics..... "

    Nothing "fanatic" here on DynacoTubeAudioForum, where respect, helpfullness and enthousiasm are the rule. All "spiced" up with some really great humour.

    This is just a fun place to be.


    Kentley

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by Kentley on Wed Apr 01, 2015 8:59 am

    Kentley,

    I've been reading this tread on diyaudio.com...... their title says it all : "Projects by fanatics, for fanatics..... "

    Nothing "fanatic" here on DynacoTubeAudioForum, where respect, helpfullness and enthousiasm are the rule. All "spiced" up with some really great humour.

    This is just a fun place to be.

    Well, a few of the "fanatics" are showing themselves, as we speak, to be pompous, petty, and, yes, vindictive and creepy. I'm sure it's not more than a small minority of them who truly believe that they invented the very electrons they seek to manipulate, and they forget that they do not actually craft their own resistors in a secret laboratory on some barren heath. The Internet is not. nor will it ever be, the paradigm of Communication, but rather the domain of The Ego. All we can do is endeavor to make our corner brighter. Cheers! sunny

    jjones3318

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by jjones3318 on Wed Apr 01, 2015 11:24 am

    Consider for a moment that your very first post on diyAudio was a product review dripping with audiophile review superlatives, that did, in fact, read like nothing short of product marketing spam. Also consider that such a forum may have issues with such spam.

    If you spend some time over there you'll find the majority are very helpful, including DF96. However, you need to understand that you're dealing with engineers - career EEs, PHds, physicists, chemists, etc. They (most of them) deal in numbers, measurements, and science. You may as well have barged in to a vegan's house and offered them bacon.

    However badly that thread started, what's transpiring in this thread is no better.






    deepee99

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    Marketing v tekkies

    Post by deepee99 on Wed Apr 01, 2015 3:54 pm

    All Kentley did was wax a tad rhapsodic on a design and a collection of parts he hadn't had the pleasure of hearing before. As an avid Dilbert fan, jjones, I share your engineer's disdain of products built around the Marketing Department's (or the accounting department's) guesstimate of what the public thinks it wants. But in this case, he has no profit motive to do so.
    I'm the first to complain, loudly and publicly, when a product I purchase does not live up to advertised expectations or croaks and the manufacturer or retailer doesn't make good.
    One's complaining rights come with a duty to express praise, equally as noisily, if a product equals or surpasses expectations. That's all Kentley did, and rightly so. He owes no apology for being a good writer. Bob, Roy, et. al don't pay to market their superb amps and pre-amps, which is why we can afford them, so it's kind of up to us to spread the word to other music freaks.
    Optimist: The glass is half-full
    Pessimist: The glass is half-empty
    Engineer: The glass is too large.




    jjones3318

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by jjones3318 on Wed Apr 01, 2015 4:12 pm

    I know he doesn't have a profit motive because I read his explanation at diyAudio after the fact, and this thread here. No one there knew what his motives were, and taken at face value could easily be interpreted as a direct violation of their forum rules: Posting overtly commercial information or advertising in non-commercial forums. His post reads no different than others I've read that were commercial spam.

    I never said he should apologize. All I asked was for people to consider how this happened; there's clearly culpability on both sides. More so, as much as I'm embarrassed by the reactions of some on diyAudio, I'm far more embarrassed by the holier-than-thou attitude displayed in this thread and Kentley's summary classification of one of the most open and helpful audio communities out there.


    Kentley

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by Kentley on Wed Apr 01, 2015 4:26 pm

    jjones3318 wrote:I know he doesn't have a profit motive because I read his explanation at diyAudio after the fact, and this thread here.  No one there knew what his motives were, and taken at face value could easily be interpreted as a direct violation of their forum rules: Posting overtly commercial information or advertising in non-commercial forums.  His post reads no different than others I've read that were commercial spam.

    I never said he should apologize.  All I asked was for people to consider how this happened; there's clearly culpability on both sides.  More so, as much as I'm embarrassed by the reactions of some on diyAudio, I'm far more embarrassed by the holier-than-thou attitude displayed in this thread and Kentley's summary classification of one of the most open and helpful audio communities out there.



    Points well made and taken, except for one. If you read my last post here, you will find that I was very careful NOT to accuse the entire DIY forum community. "A small minority....". Facts are easily manipulated - it's done every day - but let's not play that game, please.

    jjones3318

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by jjones3318 on Wed Apr 01, 2015 4:37 pm

    Seems the small minority at diyAudio aren't the only ones capable of jumping to conclusions and dishing out accusations.

    I misread that sentence. Apologies.


    Kentley

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by Kentley on Wed Apr 01, 2015 4:38 pm

    jjones3318 wrote:Seems the small minority at diyAudio aren't the only ones capable of jumping to conclusions and dishing out accusations.

    I misread that sentence.  Apologies.  


    Let's be friends. sunny

    Bob Latino
    Admin

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    Re: A tube newbie's review of the VTA ST-120

    Post by Bob Latino on Wed Apr 01, 2015 4:43 pm

    I may have to take some blame here .. Kentley sent me a copy of what he intended to post on the forum here before he posted what he wrote .. Since I don't like censorship, I told him to just post what he had sent to me. After he posted the original text here, he asked me if it was OK to post what he had written on "another tube audio forum". I said sure mainly because he has the freedom to post what he wants anyhow. If he had told me specifically that it was the "DiyAudio tubes Forum", I probably would have told him that that forum was probably not the best forum to post a review of the VTA ST-120 WIRED amp since that forum is for "DIYyourselfers" who build their own gear. It is not a forum to post about "non-DIY amps". Kentley just posted that review on the wrong forum by mistake, not knowing how the members who post there feel about a review of wired amps not assembled by the poster. . I am going to lock this thread .. There is no sense in beating this issue to death ...

    Bob

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