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    Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

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    jsl1234

    Posts : 32
    Join date : 2017-08-28

    Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by jsl1234 on Mon Sep 10, 2018 2:46 pm

    Getting ready to sell my Legacy Studio HD monitors and go shopping for a pair of previously owned Magnepan .7 planars.

    Not sure I'll find some, so am also looking out for pair of ML stats (Montis or similar model).

    The Legacy's mated well with my VTA 120 for the past year; rear ported with an AMT tweeter they are rated at 93db sensitivity with a nominal impedance of 4 ohms--very tube friendly. Not sure why I'm selling other than someone wants to purchase them for what I paid for them two years ago and since I miss the Maggie sound I thought i'd take his offer (I previously owned 1.7 and 3.7s with all Bryston electronics before moving into a small townhome sans dedicated listening room).

    Curious how many folks own a VTA 120 and connect to either of these two brands? Would really like to keep the glow of tubes in my listening room.....

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    Bob Latino
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    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by Bob Latino on Mon Sep 10, 2018 3:33 pm

    jsl1234 wrote:Getting ready to sell my Legacy Studio HD monitors and go shopping for a pair of previously owned Magnepan .7 planars.

    Not sure I'll find some, so am also looking out for pair of ML stats (Montis or similar model).

    The Legacy's mated well with my VTA 120 for the past year; rear ported with an AMT tweeter they are rated at 93db sensitivity with a nominal impedance of 4 ohms--very tube friendly. Not sure why I'm selling other than someone wants to purchase them for what I paid for them two years ago and since I miss the Maggie sound I thought i'd take his offer (I previously owned 1.7 and 3.7s with all Bryston electronics before moving into a small townhome sans dedicated listening room).

    Curious how many folks own a VTA 120 and connect to either of these two brands?  Would really like to keep the glow of tubes in my listening room.....


    I have used Maggie 3.6R's in my own home with a pair of VTA ST-120's in a biamp situation. I have also used a pair of VTA M-125's with these same speakers. In both instances the sound was great with no issues. Note that the pentode ultralinear output stage found in all VTA amps will drive speakers with complex loads (planar magnetic, electrostatic etc.) better than ANY other type of output stage found on a TUBE amp. These amps handle complex loads very well.

    Bob


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    wgallupe

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    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by wgallupe on Mon Sep 10, 2018 3:51 pm

    I was driving a pair of MMGs with a VTA ST120 with good results from the 4 ohm tap. I believe the .7 and MMG are similar in terms of load and efficiency. I sold the ST120 and now have a pair of VTA Mk III monos. They work even better. Most likely due to the independent power supplies.

    jsl1234

    Posts : 32
    Join date : 2017-08-28

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by jsl1234 on Mon Sep 10, 2018 3:53 pm

    Thanks, Bob.

    Is it correct to assume in biamp mode you are driving the tweeter and mid-range panels with the VTA 120 and driving the bass panel with that Bryston?

    If so, not sure how to relate this to driving a .7 re: I believe the .7 uses the same mid-range panel as the 1.7 but whereas the 1.7s are a three-way and the .7 is a two-way which uses the mid-range panel for lower frequency bass reproduction, I'm thinking the .7 may need more power than even your 3.6 when biamped to drive the mid-range/bass panel with authority.

    Or not  scratch

    Jay

    jsl1234

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    Join date : 2017-08-28

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by jsl1234 on Mon Sep 10, 2018 3:55 pm

    wgallupe wrote:I was driving a pair of MMGs with a VTA ST120 with good results from the 4 ohm tap. I believe the .7 and MMG are similar in terms of load and efficiency. I sold the ST120 and now have a pair of VTA Mk III monos. They work even better. Most likely due to the independent  power supplies.    

    That is the answer I'm looking for!! Now I can tell my wife I need to sell the VTA 120 and start over with a pair of VTA M-125 monos!!!! cheers
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    corndog71

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    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by corndog71 on Mon Sep 10, 2018 4:38 pm

    If you need a good sub to match the speed of the maggies then these are pretty tough to beat.

    https://www.rythmikaudio.com/F12G.html
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    cci1492

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    Location : Bergen County NJ

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by cci1492 on Mon Sep 10, 2018 4:39 pm

    keep the 120 and bi-amp with the m125s Twisted Evil Twisted Evil
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    Bob Latino
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    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by Bob Latino on Mon Sep 10, 2018 5:03 pm

    jsl1234 wrote:Thanks, Bob.

    Is it correct to assume in biamp mode you are driving the tweeter and mid-range panels with the VTA 120 and driving the bass panel with that Bryston?

    If so, not sure how to relate this to driving a .7 re: I believe the .7 uses the same mid-range panel as the 1.7 but whereas the 1.7s are a three-way and the .7 is a two-way which uses the mid-range panel for lower frequency bass reproduction, I'm thinking the .7 may need more power than even your 3.6 when biamped to drive the mid-range/bass panel with authority.

    Or not  scratch

    Jay

    No - The Bryston was the amp that I used in the early 2000's with these speakers. I still have the Bryston but I am not using it at the present time. I do not use the Bryston with the bass panel. In the photo that is shown, the two VTA ST-120's are used in a vertical biamp situation. The left ST-120 powers the left speaker with one stereo channel on the bass panel and the other ST-120 stereo channel on the the ribbon tweeter. The right ST-120 does the same for the right speaker.

    Bob

    jsl1234

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    Join date : 2017-08-28

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by jsl1234 on Mon Sep 10, 2018 5:06 pm

    Thanks for the clarification, Bob. Makes sense.
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    solderblob

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    Join date : 2018-05-20
    Location : Placerville, California

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by solderblob on Mon Sep 10, 2018 6:36 pm

    jsl1234 wrote:
    Curious how many folks own a VTA 120 and connect to either of these two brands?  Would really like to keep the glow of tubes in my listening room.....


    I have VTA Mk3s driving my old Maggie mg-1s.  (60 wpc in ultralinear tetrode mode/~30 wpc triode). In ultralinear mode they play fairly loud and the bass is surprisingly full.  In triode mode, I occasionally have issues with transients/upper midrange/treble.  So, as Bob said, the 60 wpc ultralinear operation is just the ticket.

    But, with any speakers, the sound and the bass in particular will depend a lot on your room...my room is good in that respect.  I have a pair of subs in the room (it's actually my home theater) but haven't tried them with the maggies...

    I first heard a pair of maggies in 1983.  Finally bought a used pair in 2003 -- $200.  If these ever quit working I'll buy some mg .7s.

    dave

    audiobill

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    Location : Philadelphia

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by audiobill on Tue Sep 11, 2018 5:08 am

    My KT120 loaded M125s drive my Maggie 3.6/Rs in a 14,000 cubic foot listening room very nicely.
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    Peter W.

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    Location : Melrose Park, PA

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by Peter W. on Tue Sep 11, 2018 7:27 am

    audiobill wrote:My KT120 loaded M125s drive my Maggie 3.6/Rs in a 14,000 cubic foot listening room very nicely.

    The cube root of 14,000 is a bit over 24. Are you in a former church building? Such could make a wonderful listening area!

    audiobill

    Posts : 358
    Join date : 2014-03-13
    Location : Philadelphia

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by audiobill on Tue Sep 11, 2018 7:31 am

    My great room, opening to my kitchen is 40'. The room is 20' wide with 17 1/2' ceilings.

    My math says 14,000 cubic feet.

    And yes, the 3.6/Rs sound glorious there.
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    Peter W.

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    Location : Melrose Park, PA

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by Peter W. on Tue Sep 11, 2018 7:34 am

    jsl1234 wrote:Getting ready to sell my Legacy Studio HD monitors and go shopping for a pair of previously owned Magnepan .7 planars.

    Not sure I'll find some, so am also looking out for pair of ML stats (Montis or similar model).

    The Legacy's mated well with my VTA 120 for the past year; rear ported with an AMT tweeter they are rated at 93db sensitivity with a nominal impedance of 4 ohms--very tube friendly. Not sure why I'm selling other than someone wants to purchase them for what I paid for them two years ago and since I miss the Maggie sound I thought i'd take his offer (I previously owned 1.7 and 3.7s with all Bryston electronics before moving into a small townhome sans dedicated listening room).

    Curious how many folks own a VTA 120 and connect to either of these two brands?  Would really like to keep the glow of tubes in my listening room.....


    http://www.integracoustics.com/MUG/MUG/articles/speakers.html

    This site will help you distinguish between the various variants of Maggie speakers. With that in mind, they are power-pigs of the first order, and Bob's set-up bi-amping with 120s is about the minimum I would put on the larger Maggies in any room big enough to accommodate them in the first place. In a smaller venue with the smaller panels, the 120 alone may be *just* enough.

    In my 17 x 24 x10 room, I must use a brute-force SS amp to get adequate performance from MG-IIIas.

    Enjoy - Maggies make addicts.
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    ViperZ

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    Join date : 2010-03-26

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by ViperZ on Tue Sep 11, 2018 11:21 am

    A few people will disagree, but I have successfully driven Magneplanar MG-II with a restored ST-70 for years (MG-II are pure planar, so very stable impedance over the frequency range). I tried my Apogee Stage planar/ribbon with a pair of restored MK-III. They play ok, but definitely not enough juice, and they dip down to ~2 Ohms sometimes, so not a great load for MK-III at all - moved them to Carver m-1.5t.
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    solderblob

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    Location : Placerville, California

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by solderblob on Tue Sep 11, 2018 3:57 pm

    ViperZ wrote:A few people will disagree, but I have successfully driven Magneplanar MG-II with a restored ST-70 for years (MG-II are pure planar, so very stable impedance over the frequency range). I tried my Apogee Stage planar/ribbon with a pair of restored MK-III. They play ok, but definitely not enough juice, and they dip down to ~2 Ohms sometimes, so not a great load for MK-III at all - moved them to Carver m-1.5t.

    I also drove my MG-1s with my ST-70 and it worked great.  I think the MG-1s and probably the MG-IIs are nominally 5 Ohms.  So they're a fairly easy load, but the low sensitivity of 83 dB means more ooompf is need to achive the loudness one might want.

    dave
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    Peter W.

    Posts : 966
    Join date : 2016-08-07
    Location : Melrose Park, PA

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by Peter W. on Tue Sep 11, 2018 4:13 pm

    solderblob wrote:
    ViperZ wrote:A few people will disagree, but I have successfully driven Magneplanar MG-II with a restored ST-70 for years (MG-II are pure planar, so very stable impedance over the frequency range). I tried my Apogee Stage planar/ribbon with a pair of restored MK-III. They play ok, but definitely not enough juice, and they dip down to ~2 Ohms sometimes, so not a great load for MK-III at all - moved them to Carver m-1.5t.

    I also drove my MG-1s with my ST-70 and it worked great.  I think the MG-1s and probably the MG-IIs are nominally 5 Ohms.  So they're a fairly easy load, but the low sensitivity of 83 dB means more ooompf is need to achive the loudness one might want.

    dave

    I will agree with most of the sentiments expressed so far herein. This is a function in three variables - room size & type, speaker type and efficiency, and loudness desired. Maggies are not easy speakers along these lines, but for what it's worth, and in my opinion, they are worth every bit of the effort required, and more.

    jsl1234

    Posts : 32
    Join date : 2017-08-28

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by jsl1234 on Tue Sep 11, 2018 6:24 pm

    Peter W. wrote:
    jsl1234 wrote:Getting ready to sell my Legacy Studio HD monitors and go shopping for a pair of previously owned Magnepan .7 planars.

    Not sure I'll find some, so am also looking out for pair of ML stats (Montis or similar model).

    The Legacy's mated well with my VTA 120 for the past year; rear ported with an AMT tweeter they are rated at 93db sensitivity with a nominal impedance of 4 ohms--very tube friendly. Not sure why I'm selling other than someone wants to purchase them for what I paid for them two years ago and since I miss the Maggie sound I thought i'd take his offer (I previously owned 1.7 and 3.7s with all Bryston electronics before moving into a small townhome sans dedicated listening room).

    Curious how many folks own a VTA 120 and connect to either of these two brands?  Would really like to keep the glow of tubes in my listening room.....




    http://www.integracoustics.com/MUG/MUG/articles/speakers.html    

    This site will help you distinguish between the various variants of Maggie speakers. With that in mind, they are power-pigs of the first order, and Bob's set-up bi-amping with 120s is about the minimum I would put on the larger Maggies in any room big enough to accommodate them in the first place. In a smaller venue with the smaller panels, the 120 alone may be *just* enough.

    In my 17 x 24 x10 room, I must use a brute-force SS amp to get adequate performance from MG-IIIas.

    Enjoy - Maggies make addicts.
    I'll know in 10 days or so re: ordered a pair of .7s today....

    I've gotten bunches of input plus spoke with owner at Gifted Listener in NVA--all indications are I'll be OK.

    My room is very small--10x10 I think.

    With the .7s off the rear wall about 32-36 inches, the listening position (ears to panel) is barely 7 feet.

    Given I lean towards vocals & all thinks acoustic (non-electronic jazz, string quartets, guitar, piano etc...), +80 percent of my music is pretty much mid-range and upper freq. If I really find the .7 lacking is bass output I may invest in their DWM panel (no desire for messing with traditional sub in this size room).

    jsl1234

    Posts : 32
    Join date : 2017-08-28

    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by jsl1234 on Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:15 am

    So far so good (2nd day). Running VTA 120 with attenuator at 3/4 position and at that position plenty of volume without clipping/distortion that I can tell).

    Listening position about 7 feet away, 24 inches off back wall and 3 feet of separation between speakers (tweeters outside).  Also running in my new driver tubes (Tung Sol from Jim McShane).

    A bit like Christmas in September Smile
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    deepee99

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    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by deepee99 on Thu Sep 27, 2018 3:42 pm

    I drove a pair of semi-shot MG-IIs wired in parallel with ESS Heils of yesteryear with a pair of M-125s. (The Heils picked up both the bass and compensated for the busted treble coils on the Maggies. I suspect the load got down to <2 ohms from time to time. That lash-up sounded fantastic, albeit it was a bit tough on cheap rectifiers. . . . at no point did the M-125s get hot or weird beyond what you'd expect - just warm like you'd expect from a flat 8-ohm pull.
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    pedrocols

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    Re: Experience with Maggies or other planar (including ML electrostatics).

    Post by pedrocols on Sat Sep 29, 2018 3:36 am

    Where are you located? I have a set of MG12 qr in my closet with upgraded crossovers that I would gladly let you borrow so you can have an idea of how it could potentially drive the speakers. I currently drive a pair of 1.7s with the vta-m125 and I am very happy with it.

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