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    Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

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    deepee99

    Posts : 1261
    Join date : 2012-05-23
    Location : Wallace, Idaho

    Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by deepee99 on Tue Aug 04, 2015 12:27 pm

    We had a nasty 10-second power interruption the other morning. Bang, everything's off, then bang, everything's back on. I was running all the tube gear at the time.
    This topic has been covered on many threads, but it needs repeating. A manual re-set ground-fault interrupter will save your Dynaco bacon every time. By the time the power blasted back on, I'd dashed into the living room. Everything was calm; no power to the equipment. The GFI had done its job.
    Waited 10 minutes for everything to chill, then reached under the cabinet and powered it all back up. Had the GFI not been on line there would have been emitted a lot of magic smoke.
    One has de minimus spent $50 per each on power tubes, plus a bit on rectifiers.
    A $30 investment to save your equipment is quite sensible. No matter how reliable you think your power company's lines are, there's always a drunk to run into a power pole or a winter ice storm, or somebody throwing a switch the wrong way at a distribution centre. Doesn't take but a second or two to wreck everything. A MANUAL RESET GFI is a cheap insurance policy.




    GreggW

    Posts : 55
    Join date : 2015-07-15

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by GreggW on Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:46 pm

    Which one do you use? Just took a quick look on Google and prices are all over the place.

    deepee99

    Posts : 1261
    Join date : 2012-05-23
    Location : Wallace, Idaho

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by deepee99 on Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:58 pm

    GreggW wrote:Which one do you use? Just took a quick look on Google and prices are all over the place.

    Gregg,
    I would surf Amazon, make damn sure it's a manual reset (the ones you put in for wall outlets are not) and for the correct amps you're pulling.
    15 amps should be plenty, but being an overkill kinda guy, I went for the 20-amp model.
    Either way, it's under $50 and well worth it!


    corndog71

    Posts : 444
    Join date : 2013-03-19
    Location : It can get windy here

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by corndog71 on Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:15 pm

    My PS Audio Duet has a similar feature although it resets itself when the voltage is back in the correct range. I've seen it in action. This is also another reason why I think the TDR is a great addition to any tube amp.

    Dale Stevens

    Posts : 77
    Join date : 2014-07-06
    Age : 67
    Location : Loris, SC

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by Dale Stevens on Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:26 pm

    Here's what I did on Deepee's advice some months age; http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000XVG72G?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00 Looks like $20 w/free ship.

    Just had to reset yesterday due to the storm here off the coast (SC). This thing works! Dale

    deepee99

    Posts : 1261
    Join date : 2012-05-23
    Location : Wallace, Idaho

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by deepee99 on Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:34 pm

    Dale Stevens wrote:Here's what I did on Deepee's advice some months age;  http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000XVG72G?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00  Looks like $20 w/free ship.

    Just had to reset yesterday due to the storm here off the coast  (SC).  This thing works!   Dale

    Dale, glad to hear. Only reason I put this post up is because we have some new folks aboard who may not know the necessity of these critters. Cheapest insurance on the planet - we get crummy wx here, too. Just nice not to see a lightning bolt shoot across your amp(s) when the grid lights back up.

    sKiZo

    Posts : 1287
    Join date : 2013-04-01
    Location : Michigan USA

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by sKiZo on Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:13 pm

    Dale Stevens wrote:Here's what I did on Deepee's advice some months age;  http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000XVG72G?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00  Looks like $20 w/free ship.

    Nice of Deepee to point those out ... clown

    We had some pretty serious stuff blow through here the other night ...

    FLASH FLASH!FLASH!! Wahoo!

    I was listening to Kompendium's Beneath the Waves at the time, cranking it to get over the rumbling outside. Needless to say, I can take a hint and left it off the rest of the storm.

    (Killer storm music btw ...)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bKYYfaLgcg

    There's an instrumental version as well that I swap in every now and then.

    MontanaWay

    Posts : 767
    Join date : 2014-02-06
    Age : 58
    Location : Cameron, Montana

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by MontanaWay on Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:36 pm

    yup...gotta have one of those...saved my bacon...or tubes....more than once!!
    In fact, in my gears user manual, I have a whole paragraph on this very subject and recommend for the user to get one of these MANUAL reset GFI's!

    bluemeanies

    Posts : 119
    Join date : 2015-02-09
    Age : 66
    Location : Folsom Pa.

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by bluemeanies on Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:56 pm

    Good show Deepee99
    My I have the Furman Elite line conditioner/surge protector.

    deepee99

    Posts : 1261
    Join date : 2012-05-23
    Location : Wallace, Idaho

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by deepee99 on Tue Aug 04, 2015 10:36 pm

    bluemeanies wrote:Good show Deepee99
    My I have the Furman Elite line conditioner/surge protector.

    Blue,
    I swear by my Furman in terms of voltage control and surge protection, but it's on-off with the line juice so no protection for the power supply and big tubes from momentary outages. If the caps are still discharging when the power comes back on, Bam!
    I think Bob's option of the 15-second start-up delay covers this contingency as well, but you'd have to ask him. I have those in my Big Boppers but have never prodded the devil to find out if that's enough.
    If the GFI shuts things off I wait until the toobs are cool before turning things back on. Maybe that's overkill, but these barnacle-crusted 6550s are worth being nice to.



    Gregg R.

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    Join date : 2014-02-20
    Age : 71
    Location : Land of 11,842 Lakes

    Ground Fault Interrupter

    Post by Gregg R. on Wed Aug 05, 2015 2:37 am

    I got this unit on eBay a few months ago:

    GFI

    The photo is somewhat misleading; the device is 28 inches long and weighs about 1.4 lbs.
    Surprisingly, we have not had a power outage this summer, or even any severe weather. It's still good protection, however.

    bluemeanies

    Posts : 119
    Join date : 2015-02-09
    Age : 66
    Location : Folsom Pa.

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by bluemeanies on Wed Aug 05, 2015 7:08 am

    Deepee99...do you have the TUBES plugged into the FURMAN and the FURMAN plugged into the GFI or the tubes connected to the GFI directly?

    sKiZo

    Posts : 1287
    Join date : 2013-04-01
    Location : Michigan USA

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by sKiZo on Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:15 am

    Worth repeating ...

    There's several of these available, but the important thing to look for is NON-LATCHING. The unit should trip on a blip, but MUST require manual reset to do what we need, which is to break the circuit and protect our tubes until we're ready to go again. Most GFCI circuit breakers will reset automatically when the power comes back, and that's not what we want here.

    Whatever you use, press the test switch and confirm the power breaks and stays off until you hit the reset switch. Then you know for sure.

    PS ... these are mostly used in construction. Your power goes out, you don't want things like rip saws and such starting up again on their own if you're not ready for it.


    MontanaWay

    Posts : 767
    Join date : 2014-02-06
    Age : 58
    Location : Cameron, Montana

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by MontanaWay on Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:18 am

    sKiZo wrote:Worth repeating ...

    There's several of these available, but the important thing to look for is NON-LATCHING. The unit should trip on a blip, but MUST require manual reset to do what we need, which is to break the circuit and protect our tubes until we're ready to go again. Most GFCI circuit breakers will reset automatically when the power comes back, and that's not what we want here.

    Whatever you use, press the test switch and confirm the power breaks and stays off until you hit the reset switch. Then you know for sure.

    PS ... these are mostly used in construction. Your power goes out, you don't want things like rip saws and such starting up again on their own if you're not ready for it.


    and it is worth saying, most of the GFCI's installed in your home ARE NOT SUITABLE....they reset automatically.
    Bob, maybe a sticky on this subject under its own heading, for all to see and read.

    deepee99

    Posts : 1261
    Join date : 2012-05-23
    Location : Wallace, Idaho

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by deepee99 on Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:38 am

    bluemeanies wrote:Deepee99...do you have the TUBES plugged into the FURMAN and the FURMAN plugged into the GFI or the tubes connected to the GFI directly?

    Hi, Bluemeanies,
    The correct arrangement is to plug the manual-reset GFI into the wall, the Furmnan plugged into the GFI, and the tubes all plugged into the Furman's power strip.

    And yeah, what Skizo and Montana Way said.

    I don't precisely know why Hafler/Dynaco/VTA designs are particularly vulnerable to power blips; perhaps it is the simplicity and cleanliness of their power supplies. Some of the McIntosh and AR power supplies I've seen are Byzantine in their complexity.

    audiobill

    Posts : 271
    Join date : 2014-03-13
    Location : Philadelphia

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by audiobill on Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:40 am

    $12.78 at Home Depot?

    http://www.homedepot.com/p/Tower-Manufacturing-Corporation-3-Wire-GFCI-Outlet-Adapter-30439005/202510242

    MontanaWay

    Posts : 767
    Join date : 2014-02-06
    Age : 58
    Location : Cameron, Montana

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by MontanaWay on Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:43 am

    audiobill wrote:$12.78 at Home Depot?

    http://www.homedepot.com/p/Tower-Manufacturing-Corporation-3-Wire-GFCI-Outlet-Adapter-30439005/202510242

    just make sure it is MANUAL reset...that's the ONLY important factor here....M A N U A L reset....then you're OK!!
    If it does not say so in the description of the unit, then either call and find out or even better, look for one that states the fact that it is a manual reset unit.

    deepee99

    Posts : 1261
    Join date : 2012-05-23
    Location : Wallace, Idaho

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by deepee99 on Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:00 am

    MontanaWay wrote:
    audiobill wrote:$12.78 at Home Depot?

    http://www.homedepot.com/p/Tower-Manufacturing-Corporation-3-Wire-GFCI-Outlet-Adapter-30439005/202510242

    just make sure it is MANUAL reset...that's the ONLY important factor here....M A N U A L reset....then you're OK!!
    If it does not say so in the description of the unit, then either call and find out or even better, look for one that states the fact that it is a manual reset unit.

    Yep. Seems to be manual reset but check to be sure. 15 amps is probably adequate. My all-tube system, with eight 6550s based at .5VDC, and a boat-load of 6SN7s in the pre-amp and driver slots, novals in the phono preamp, and the pair of 1kw s/s/ Class D amplifiers in the speaks, pulls 5.1 amps. Replacing the 6550s with KT-120s biased at .6VDC brings the pull up to about 7 amps. The flat-screen TV, DVD player and Roku box draw another 2 amps.
    To be on the safe side I went to a 20-amp rating back when I had the Vandersteens, because their woofer amps drew a little more current than do the ones in the Tylers.


    Last edited by deepee99 on Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:35 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Clarity)

    bluemeanies

    Posts : 119
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    Location : Folsom Pa.

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by bluemeanies on Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:51 am

    Thanks deepee99

    Dale Stevens

    Posts : 77
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    Age : 67
    Location : Loris, SC

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by Dale Stevens on Wed Aug 05, 2015 4:29 pm

    Bob,
    X2 for a STICKY on this; new folks coming on. Thx, Dale

    frank

    Posts : 95
    Join date : 2011-02-14
    Location : Pacific Northwest

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by frank on Sat Aug 08, 2015 3:11 pm

    I don't remember who originally posted about these, but it is the world's greatest tip for Dynaco tube amp owners. Mine has saved my butt several times over these past years. Maybe I wouldn't have had issues anyway, but it's great to know I didn't for sure. I get a lot of momentary power outages when it gets really hot. Our supply doesn't seem to expect the A/C use that the new developments draw.

    There is no excuse for not getting a MANUAL RESET GFCI.  If you have a Dynaco, or even some other tube amp, get one. It is the cheapest insurance you will ever have a chance for.

    'Frank


    Last edited by frank on Sat Aug 08, 2015 3:44 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : took out a comma. do you mind?)

    sKiZo

    Posts : 1287
    Join date : 2013-04-01
    Location : Michigan USA

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by sKiZo on Sat Aug 08, 2015 3:32 pm

    Thanx for the reminder. ... I'm always singing the praises of these things, and almost had a dOH! moment here.

    Just got a mono tube amp for the center channel on my Oppo and need to remember to "T" that into the GFCI adapter. It's only another couple amps, so plenty of capacity paired up with the ST120 on the same circuit. Right now it's just plugged straight into the wall current while testing it out.

    EDIT > > The GFCI does NOT like having both the ST120 and the Eico plugged in with a "T" connector. Fired both up and it tripped twice on idle while the amps warmed. Not sure if it has issues with the grounding design on the Eico or what ... it's an unusual design. I'll pick up another GFCI and give that a try. If it still has issues, I'm sure I can find all sorts of places to use it otherwise.


    Last edited by sKiZo on Sat Aug 08, 2015 7:33 pm; edited 1 time in total

    audiobill

    Posts : 271
    Join date : 2014-03-13
    Location : Philadelphia

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by audiobill on Sat Aug 08, 2015 3:54 pm

    The Home Depot unit for $12.78 is a manual reset unit.

    10-E-C

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    Age : 62
    Location : upper east tn

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by 10-E-C on Sun Aug 21, 2016 10:54 am

    The manual ground fault reset worked to perfection yesterday, when out of the blue my power flashed off for a second and right back on. All four of my tubes were on, M125's, Holger's pre and phono amp. I've had two of the manual reset GFI's for over 2 years to my equipment and it paid off.

    TM

    j4570

    Posts : 141
    Join date : 2010-08-30

    Re: Saved (again) by the Ground-Fault Interruptor

    Post by j4570 on Mon Aug 22, 2016 1:46 pm

    The TRC on Amazon is manual reset. I have two of them (one white, one yellow, whichever was cheaper at the time....). One on my tube amp and one on the overhead electric cord reel in my garage. If you think blowing the rectifier is bad, imagine a router or circular saw restarting a few seconds after a power blip-you are in the dark when the lights flash back on and you are holding a spinning power tool that reenergizes power. Once I discovered these, I love them.

    The one at Home Depot I'm not convinced are manual-seems I went and looked there when I got mine. The other ones of that brand state auto reset-not what you want.

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