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The Dynaco Tube Audio Forum

Dedicated to the restoration and preservation of all original Dynaco tube audio equipment - Customer support for Tubes4hifi VTA tube amp and preamp kits and all Dynakitparts.com products


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Bob Latino
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Kentley
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    do vta 70 , vta120 sounds the same ???

    wantech
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    wantech


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    • Post n°1

    do vta 70 , vta120 sounds the same ??? Empty do vta 70 , vta120 sounds the same ???

    Post by wantech Sun Oct 01, 2017 10:49 am

    thinking of buying VTA70 or VTA120
    which one to choose ? suggestions ?

    I have B&W 801 mk3 speakers in a 10x12 small room.
    also have a pair of Proac tabblettte 3 special edition
    I use the Paoli M60 with 8417
    I have 12 new and old McIntosh RCA and GE 6L6gc, 4 new tubes from my old Mac 240, try to use them
    listening cd and vinyl

    any SUGGESTIONS.......
    thanks

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    Kentley
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    • Post n°2

    do vta 70 , vta120 sounds the same ??? Empty Re: do vta 70 , vta120 sounds the same ???

    Post by Kentley Sun Oct 01, 2017 1:08 pm

    While the B&W 801s are rated as relatively efficient, in order to wring the real bass potential out of those beasts, you really need at minimum the 60 WPC of the ST-120. Even better would be a pair of M-125s.
    I own a pair of {non-functioning} B&W 803 Matrixes {Matrices?}. I know of what I rant.
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    Dogstar
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    • Post n°3

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    Post by Dogstar Sun Oct 01, 2017 2:49 pm

    All things considered they will sound different because of the types of tubes used in each amp. But because they are both push-pull amps they will amplify sound the same way.
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    Bob Latino
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    • Post n°4

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    Post by Bob Latino Sun Oct 01, 2017 5:22 pm

    Dogstar wrote:All things considered they will sound different because of the types of tubes used in each amp. But because they are both push-pull amps they will amplify sound the same way.

    What Dogstar has said is pretty much true .. The major difference between these two amps is one of POWER. Both amps use the same driver circuit with almost the same resistor set. They also use the same driver tubes. Since the ST-70 normally uses EL34 output tubes and the ST-120 uses 6550/KT88/KT120, there will be a slight difference in sound due to the output tube difference. That said, you CAN use KT88 or 6550 output tubes in the VTA ST-70. The ST-120 will play about 3 dB louder than the ST70. The ST-120 also gives you more future speaker choices since it will drive lower efficiency speakers better than the ST-70.

    Bob
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    MarcVBelgium
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    • Post n°5

    do vta 70 , vta120 sounds the same ??? Empty Re: do vta 70 , vta120 sounds the same ???

    Post by MarcVBelgium Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:09 am

    For the B&W 801 MkIII, I would never consider a tube amp. It may not bring this speaker "alive". The 801 was designed (late seventies) with BIG power amps (at that time with Phase Linear 700B) with lots of power and a huge damping factor. It may have a high efficiency, but is very, very hard to drive well. In its design, tube amps were not even considered. (I've worked with the B&W distributor on several audioshows in the late seventies). So before going that path, be sure to test the "match" beforehand. Otherwise you might get dissapointed. The M-125 would be minimum, I guess...
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    wantech
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    • Post n°6

    do vta 70 , vta120 sounds the same ??? Empty Re: do vta 70 , vta120 sounds the same ???

    Post by wantech Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:00 am

    MarcVBelgium wrote:For the B&W 801 MkIII, I would never consider a tube amp. It may not bring this speaker "alive". The 801 was designed (late seventies) with BIG power amps (at that time with Phase Linear 700B) with lots of power and a huge damping factor. It may have a high efficiency, but is very, very hard to drive well. In its design, tube amps were not even considered. (I've worked with the B&W distributor on several audioshows in the late seventies).  So before going that path, be sure to test the "match" beforehand. Otherwise you might get dissapointed. The M-125 would be minimum, I guess...


    Any suggestions on speakers ???
    please,
    I have a pair of Proac Tablette response
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    MarcVBelgium
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    • Post n°7

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    Post by MarcVBelgium Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:22 am

    The Proac Tablette is a wonderful little speaker. It does sound amazing on tubes. Personally I use Tannoy (DC10A) on my ST-120.
    By all this I did not say that the 801 is not a fine speaker, just not (IMHO) on tubes.
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    LeGrace
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    • Post n°8

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    Post by LeGrace Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:41 am

    MarcVBelgium wrote:The Proac Tablette is a wonderful little speaker. It does sound amazing on tubes. Personally I use Tannoy (DC10A) on my ST-120.  
    By all this I did not say that the 801 is not a fine speaker, just not (IMHO) on tubes.

    Ref your speakers a drool emoticon would be fitting except I dont see one.

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    MarcVBelgium
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    • Post n°9

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    Post by MarcVBelgium Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:53 am

    Indeed, I feel privileged (they were 2nd hand) as they are match made in heaven with the ST-120
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    Peter W.
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    • Post n°10

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    Post by Peter W. Wed Oct 11, 2017 2:14 pm

    It is my experience that speakers will sound differently when driven to/near the clipping points of various amplifiers. Assuming infinite headroom, most decent speakers will handle massive amounts of watts (delivered cleanly) and some will really open up as a result. Further to this, very good speakers fed from a clean signal through a clean source will deliver ear-bleeding volume quite easily.

    CAVEAT: I am writing of a musical source with a Peak-to-Average of at least 20 dB. Some highly compressed material will damage speakers even if the amp does have massive amounts of headroom - there is just too much energy in too narrow a bandwidth to be safe.

    So, cutting to the chase - headroom extends the clipping point. Which is very good given the logarithmic nature of sound. 35 vs. 60 watts is only about 2.5 dB in volume. Seems like a lot at the front end, not so much at the back end.
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